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joebanana 01-20-2020 01:04 PM

"Alizée en Concert" - Translation Project 2020
 
We are working on the best possible translation "Alizée en Concert" and we started with song Gourmandise.
Any suggestion, help, opinion ... is welcome.


When you think of me,
You, the wolf of the Steppes,
Down deep inside of you
Do you feel ecstasy?
"I'm yearning so much for you"
You say it without cease,
"And take care of me"
Tell me if that hurts.
Oh wolf, are you there for me?
You made the promise,
And if I offer myself to you,
It's as thousands of tender kisses.

There are the kisses
The first
Taste like sea spray
Taste like melancholy,
There are the kisses stolen
In the trains of Tsarinas.
The kisses of a summer
Where the hand is led forward
But the kisses of Alizée
Are the true delicacies

When I think of you,
You, the wolf of the Steppes
I am not afraid of you,
Does that worry you?
"Take that path there,"
You say it without cease
"Oh! Bed down near to me
And devour me with your eyes, my princess!"

For the kisses
The first
Taste like sea spray
Taste like melancholy
For the kisses stolen
In the trains of Tsarinas.
The kisses of a summer
Where the hand is led forward
But the kisses of Alizée
Are the true delicacies.

Oh wolf, are you there...
Oh wolf, are you there...
Oh wolf, are you there...
Oh wolf, are you there...
Oh wolf, are you there...
Oh wolf, are you there...
Oh wolf, are you there...

There are the kisses
The first
Taste like sea spray
Taste like melancholy,
There are the kisses stolen
In the trains of Tsarinas.
The kisses of a summer
Where the hand is led forward
But the kisses of Alizée
Are the true delicacies

There are the kisses
The first
Taste like sea spray
Taste like melancholy,
There are the kisses stolen
In the trains of Tsarinas.
The kisses of a summer
Where the hand is led forward
But the kisses of Alizée
Are the true delicacies

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MshULZzbpc0

Bamagirl 01-20-2020 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268537)
We are working on the best possible translation "Alizée en Concert" and we started with song Gourmandise.
Any suggestion, help, opinion ... is welcome.

I met with my translator today, and he had some pretty interesting things to say about the lyrics.
Below, I will type out the translation that he wrote. He explained that the word "spleen" in this translates to "sorrow" or "melancholy." He said it is similar to the way in English we will say something like "I feel it in my gut" but we aren't literally referring to our "guts."
He said the term was created by a poet named Charles Baudelaire, and he said he can tell there is influence by that poet throughout the lyrics. There is also a Russian theme. Not only the part with the tsarinas (the meaning of which he said is a bit obscure, even in the French) but also the part about the wolf of the Steppes. That, he said, refers to Russian vegetation.

He isn't sure about the whole "train" thing--he is going to actually listen to the song itself (I just gave him the typed out lyrics) and let me know if he thinks it means something else. But so far he thinks it means a literal train, as opposed to part of a dress. He said he can't see any idioms that it would refer to (like with "spleen"). He said he wasn't sure if "Tsarinas" was supposed to be plural or possessive (as in "Tsarina's").

The part about the "sea spray" translates more into "essence." There is not a term for this in English, but it is talking about how the person's essence is like a spray that comes outward from them. It has nothing to do with the actual sea. That is just the literal translation for something we don't have a word for in English

"Taste" is more just the meaning of "experience" rather than tasting as a flavor on your tongue.

He said he does not find that there is an overtly graphic sexual message--it is more one of want and love and need. The "wolf" represents a strong person who needs Alizée and who she needs and wants to protect her and take care of her.

All in all, it seems like I’m some places these lyrics are like what happens with a lot of poetry and song lyrics in English, too— parts are kind of hard to decipher. But I think he did a decent job with his translation.


Greediness

When you think about me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you
Do you feel intoxicated?
I am starving for you
You say it without end
And take care of me
Tell me if that hurts
Oh wolf, are you there for me?
You make the promise
And, if I offer myself to you
It is in thousands of tender kisses.

There are the kisses
The first taste of your essence
Taste of sorrow
There are stolen kisses
In the train of the Tsarinas
A summer of kisses
Where the hand travels
But Alizee's kisses
Are really delighful

Silencio 01-21-2020 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bamagirl (Post 268541)
but also the part about the wolf of the Steppes. That, he said, refers to Russian vegetation.

It is reference to the novel "Steppenwolf" ("The wolf of the Steppes") by Herman Hesse.

You can read more about this song here:
http://alizeeamerica.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1563

Mr Coucou 01-21-2020 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silencio (Post 268545)
It is reference to the novel "Steppenwolf" ("The wolf of the Steppes") by Herman Hesse.

You can read more about this song here:
http://alizeeamerica.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1563

:thumb:

We should create an "index" of all the older analysis of Gour and MCE.

Bamagirl 01-21-2020 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silencio (Post 268545)
It is reference to the novel "Steppenwolf" ("The wolf of the Steppes") by Herman Hesse.

You can read more about this song here:
http://alizeeamerica.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1563

Oh, that is very cool! Thank you.

joebanana 01-21-2020 06:42 PM

Great help from your friend Bamagirl, lots of material to think about.

Scruffydog777 01-22-2020 12:43 PM

Quite a few years back, I hooked up with a young lady to do some translations for me such as the ones for Dals and Saga and a few interviews. She grew up in Paris and was a couple of years younger than Alizee, then moved to this country and got married.

I also had her do translations for the songs Alcaline and K.O. which I added to the two videos I made. There were two lines that I couldn't quite figure out a good translation for and I asked her a few times about it and she told me sometimes the singers make a compromise of writing lyrics that may not make a lot of sense, for something that sounds good.

Mr Coucou 01-22-2020 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777 (Post 268553)
There were two lines that I couldn't quite figure out a good translation for and I asked her a few times about it and she told me sometimes the singers make a compromise of writing lyrics that may not make a lot of sense, for something that sounds good.

That's a good point. From making up their own idioms, to abstract gibberish.

Speaking of abstract gibberish:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4PZadLP9QM

joebanana 01-22-2020 10:11 PM

When you think about me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you

or


When you think of me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you

What is better option for start?

Scruffydog777 01-23-2020 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Coucou (Post 268554)
That's a good point. From making up their own idioms, to abstract gibberish.

Speaking of abstract gibberish:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4PZadLP9QM

Interesting song.....go cart Mozart!

I should have said when I mentioned that some artists will put in lines for rhyme than for reason, that I didn't think this was the case with Gourmandises.

Edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268557)
When you think about me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you

or


When you think of me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you

What is better option for start?

I first want to mention when you bring something up like this in the forum, you may have 10 different people offer opinions and all of them might be different, which makes it tough. In the end, it's your project and you have to figure out what best fits what you are trying to do.

For me, when adding subs, I try my best with the subs I add to match the syllable count of the song as long as I don't compromise meaning.

So for that first line it's

Quand tu penses a moi, which looks to be six syllables but to me in the song, only sounds like five so because of that, I'd go with "When you think of me"

Mr Coucou 01-23-2020 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268557)
When you think about me

or

When you think of me

"Think of me" and "Think about me" have the same meaning.

I like "Think of me", because it has the fewest syllables. It sounds more "direct."

Aragorn97 01-23-2020 09:42 AM

Given that...
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Coucou (Post 268561)
"Think of me" and "Think about me" have the same meaning.

..., I prefer "think of me". If you sing the lyrics in English, "of" fits better than "about".

joebanana 01-23-2020 12:47 PM

I think it's best to go with what most people think is right.

When you think of me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you
--------------------------------------------Done

I have some suggestions to continue:

1)
Feel the intoxication
I yearn so much for you
Is what you say without end

2)
Do you feel intoxicated?
I am starving for you
You say it without end

3)
Do you feel ecstasy?
"I'm yearning so much for you"
You say it without cease

4)
your solution

Scruffydog777 01-23-2020 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268563)
I think it's best to go with what most people think is right.

When you think of me
You the wolf of the Steppes
Deep inside of you
--------------------------------------------Done

I have some suggestions to continue:

1)
Feel the intoxication
I yearn so much for you
Is what you say without end

2)
Do you feel intoxicated?
I am starving for you
You say it without end

3)
Do you feel ecstasy?
"I'm yearning so much for you"
You say it without cease

4)
your solution

Maybe ecstasy is closer in sound to what is being said, but I think I would go with #1. The reason being is I think the way Alizee would pronounce the end of intoxication would be fairly similar to the way she pronounced the end of 'passion' in ACC and that's a beautiful sound. It's kind of an off the wall reason, but still one that makes me want to choose it over ecstasy.

https://youtu.be/H3Ioxh3OTSU

In fact there are a few lines in that verse that end in ion...…….


https://youtu.be/H3Ioxh3OTSU?t=144

joebanana 01-23-2020 02:27 PM

Do i miss anything related to her 2003/04 concert? this is what i have.


https://drive.google.com/file/d/1giC...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1zNl...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nXJ...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-s4...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/18_0...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YtY...ew?usp=sharing


There are also some videos from the audience


https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ciG...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LkX...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Y4H...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/147g...ew?usp=sharing


I also know about audio recordings

http://www.mylenelive.com/menu.html

Bamagirl 01-25-2020 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777 (Post 268558)
For me, when adding subs, I try my best with the subs I add to match the syllable count of the song as long as I don't compromise meaning.

Scruffydog, you have hit on the universal problem encountered when translating poetry. There can be an exceedingly accurate translation as far as meaning goes, but then there is the issue of making the verse sound good and be "poetic." That is in a whole other realm of creativity, and it certainly requires a lot more thought and effort than a straightforward translation. A purely literal translation is usually not ideal because, as we are seeing, there are so many words and phrases that are used to express something other than their actual definitions. But to work to get the spirit of the verse, as well as make it melodic, is definitely a complicated project!

joebanana 02-02-2020 11:32 AM

When i mix all the suggestions we get this



https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tbw...ew?usp=sharing

joebanana 02-03-2020 11:10 AM

A-Contre-Courant

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FyE...ew?usp=sharing

Scruffydog777 02-03-2020 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268644)
When i mix all the suggestions we get this



https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tbw...ew?usp=sharing

That's pretty good joebanana, but there is one simple thing I think needs correction. That is the parts where she's singing "to, to, to".

You're providing an English translation and that word is mostly used as a preposition that doesn't seem to fit the song.

Now there's a small possibility that what she is saying is "tu,tu,tu", which would mean you,you,you which would fit I think in most cases what is being said in the song.

But I think this is just meant to be a pleasant sounding filler for the song, much in the way when she sings "ba da da da da bum" in J'en ai marre and for that reason, I'd just drop adding the translations to that section.

joebanana 02-03-2020 01:07 PM

I was thinking about it.
The reason why I added it ,is that it somehow connects subtitles and singing,
but I'm not too happy with that either.
I’ll probably delete that

joebanana 02-04-2020 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268647)



These are the original subtitles from the video I used

Our universe
Against the current
All upside down...
Not for long!
When you are on Earth
Keep me informed
So I imagine...
Our fusions.
We desire each other
Under high tension
But no power…
sockets, I win...
...your smiles
And my electrons
A ball of life
Ball of balloons
Nothing ordinary
Nothing but good times
Head is upside-down...
Not for long.
When you are on Earth
Keep me informed
So I guess...
The intentions.
We electrify each other
Maximal tension
The body currents...
Of two lovers
We illuminate each other
Instinctive light
The school of the...
...electromagnet.

Rediscover the meaning
Of life, I think
Go through the boredom
When you, you are gone
Rediscover the directions
Moments that are insolent
Processions of fingers,
Of my desire for you.
When the current passes, also the threat
Of the time that flies, the time which separates us
And the current passes, I have in me the audacity
Of the magnetic field, and that is great!

Our universe
Against the current
Return to Earth
And for good
When you long for me
Keep me informed
So I envision...
A rebellion
We remain static
When I say no to him
No more than six...
Speeches
He makes me panic
Of electrocution
My insulator
It's passion


And this is one interesting solution for possible improvement


Our universes
Against the current
All upside down...
But not for long!
When you’re grounded.....................(When you are on Earth)
Plug me to the current...................(Keep me informed)
And I will imagine...
Our fusions
We desire each other
Under high voltage
No plugs or sockets Of nerves.
I concilidate your laughs
And my electrons
A dance of life
A dance of balloons
Nothing ordinary
Nothing but good times
Head is upside-down...
Not for too long.
When you’re grounded
Plug me to the current
And I will foretell...
Your intentions.
We electrify each other........................(We charge up)
Maximal tension
The body currents..............................(Body circuits)
Of two lovers
We illuminate each other.......................(We brighten up)
Instinctive light..............................(Wild light)
The school of ...
Electromagnet.

To find the direction......................................... ....(Rediscover the meaning)
Of life, is what I think..........................................(Of life, I think)
(The courrent) Passes through the boredom..............(Go through the boredom)
When you are gone
To find the way
Moments that are insolent
Of the march of fingers,
Of my desire for you.
When the current passes,
also the threat
Of the time that flies,
the time which separates us
And the current passes,
I have in me the audacity
Of the magnetic field,
and that is great!

Our universes
Against the current
Come grounded again
And for good
When you wait for me
Plug me to the current
And I plan...
A rebellion
Static is made
When I tell him no,
No more than six..
announcements
It panics me
With electrocution
My insulator
It's passion

What do you think?

Scruffydog777 02-04-2020 05:38 PM

Here is what I suggest for ACC and it's far from perfect so I invite others to add some input......

Here are my thoughts on this song. I added changes to the right of what I think needed change.

Our universe
Against the current
All upside down...
Not for long!........................But not for long
When you are on Earth........When you're on Earth
Keep me informed...............Keep me current
So I imageine.................... ...So I can imagine
Our fusions.
We desire each other
Under high tension
================================================== ==============
In the next three lines I think most of us know, they broke up the word concilie (to reconcile)
They had the con as the last word of "De nerfs, je con"
and they had cilie as the first word of the line ,"cilie tes rires".
The word prises, when used with the word "electrique" following it means
electrical outlets which would seem to fit the theme of the song. It would also have somewhat of a Freudian meaning to it which is right up Mylene's alley.
So though I think
outlets was a hidden meaning, I think the other meaning works here.
For the three lines, I'd put
"No catches
of nerves, I recon................cile, the laughter"
That combines the last two lines which I think would better show in the English
subtitles, what is going on.
It uses c twice in reconcile (recconcile), but I think that will work out okay
================================================== =====================
And my electrons
A dance of life
A dance of balloons


Nothing ordinary
Nothing but good times
Head is upside-down...........Head's upside down
Not for long..........................but not for long
When you are on Earth..........When you're on Earth
Keep me informed.................keep me current.
So I guess................................so I can guess
The intentions........................your intentions
We electrify each other...........We elect
Maximal tension.......................maximum tension
The body currents.....................the body circuits
Of two lovers
We illuminate each other...........We light up
Instinctive light...........................an animal light (I'm tempted to put "an animalistic light" here which I think would fit the story well but I think it is too long)
The school of the...
...electromagnet.......................... The school of...........electromagnatism
================================================== =============================

Going through these last lines, you really have to figure out what the entire verse is trying
to say and in doing that, I came up with these changes.
Rediscover the meaning
Of life, I think
Go through the boredom......................................Going through boredome
When you, you are gone........................................when you had left
Rediscover the directions.......................................R egaining the senses (from???)
Moments that are insolent
Processions of fingers........................................... ..fingerprints (thus evidence)
Of my desire for you.
When the current passes, also the threat................. menace should be used in place of threat
Of the time that flies, the time which separates us
And the current passes, I have in me the audacity
Of the magnetic field, and that is great! Here I'm tempted to use magnifique. I think most people would know the meaning of it.

joebanana 02-04-2020 11:00 PM

I'm not saying this is correct but Google says it is plural. "Our universes"

Nos univers-Our universes
Notre univers-Our univers

Scruffydog777 02-05-2020 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268660)
I'm not saying this is correct but Google says it is plural. "Our universes"

Nos univers-Our universes
Notre univers-Our univers

Well I think that's a relatively minor point. Either way would work, but it seems to me when she's singing it, it sounds like "universe".

https://youtu.be/wrBGegJTJlE?t=20

https://youtu.be/OBMVFSit4gE?t=17

joebanana 02-05-2020 11:32 AM

like I said, it's just Google,but I noticed that a lot of people translate it as "Our universes"
I found some analysis of the song A contre-courant,maybe it can help with the translation.

http://alizeeamerica.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1678

Scruffydog777 02-06-2020 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 268664)
like I said, it's just Google,but I noticed that a lot of people translate it as "Our universes"
I found some analysis of the song A contre-courant,maybe it can help with the translation.

http://alizeeamerica.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1678

Here's a picture of some of those analysis along with some notes......

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1yah...ew?usp=sharing

The translation is a help, but it's a translation to fully explain the song. It's intent is not to find an English translation of the lyrics that will sound good in place of the French lyrics. To do that, compromises need to be made.
Another thing you have to realize is if 3 different people try to explain this, they'll probably will have 3 different interpretations and in some cases very different interpretations. I'm sure RMJ of Alizee Art has interpretations of all these songs and though I'm sure he put a lot of time and effort into them. he is originally from Finland.
I still like my version. Just taking a quick look of the interpretation you posted a link to, here are some notes.

1: Again I prefer "So I can imagine".

2: "............Under high voltage". In this country, high tension lines are the usually the large power lines that are high up on a tower, running in between cities that carry thousands of volts of electricity. Under high tension, I think sounds better than under high voltage and it's what she is saying in the song.

3: "But no takes..... of nerfs.....". Nerfs is not an English word that applies here imo.

4 : It's my experience that I have not heard the word maximal used in this way very often. It is the correct use, but I think maximum is used more often and I think it's easier to understand.

That's as far as I went with this. I still like my version. With coming up with the English lyrics, sometimes you have to sacrifice 'some' meaning for sound and sometimes you have to sacrifice "some' sound for meaning.

Scruffydog777 02-06-2020 10:32 AM

I think the

Mais pas de prises...
De nerfs, je con...
...cilie tes rires


needs something better.

joebanana 02-09-2020 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777 (Post 268657)
Here is what I suggest for ACC and it's far from perfect so I invite others to add some input......

Here are my thoughts on this song. I added changes to the right of what I think needed change.

Our universe
Against the current
All upside down...
Not for long!........................But not for long
When you are on Earth........When you're on Earth
Keep me informed...............Keep me current
So I imageine.................... ...So I can imagine
Our fusions.
We desire each other
Under high tension
================================================== ==============
In the next three lines I think most of us know, they broke up the word concilie (to reconcile)
They had the con as the last word of "De nerfs, je con"
and they had cilie as the first word of the line ,"cilie tes rires".
The word prises, when used with the word "electrique" following it means
electrical outlets which would seem to fit the theme of the song. It would also have somewhat of a Freudian meaning to it which is right up Mylene's alley.
So though I think
outlets was a hidden meaning, I think the other meaning works here.
For the three lines, I'd put
"No catches
of nerves, I recon................cile, the laughter"
That combines the last two lines which I think would better show in the English
subtitles, what is going on.
It uses c twice in reconcile (recconcile), but I think that will work out okay
================================================== =====================
And my electrons
A dance of life
A dance of balloons


Nothing ordinary
Nothing but good times
Head is upside-down...........Head's upside down
Not for long..........................but not for long
When you are on Earth..........When you're on Earth
Keep me informed.................keep me current.
So I guess................................so I can guess
The intentions........................your intentions
We electrify each other...........We elect
Maximal tension.......................maximum tension
The body currents.....................the body circuits
Of two lovers
We illuminate each other...........We light up
Instinctive light...........................an animal light (I'm tempted to put "an animalistic light" here which I think would fit the story well but I think it is too long)
The school of the...
...electromagnet.......................... The school of...........electromagnatism
================================================== =============================

Going through these last lines, you really have to figure out what the entire verse is trying
to say and in doing that, I came up with these changes.
Rediscover the meaning
Of life, I think
Go through the boredom......................................Going through boredome
When you, you are gone........................................when you had left
Rediscover the directions.......................................R egaining the senses (from???)
Moments that are insolent
Processions of fingers........................................... ..fingerprints (thus evidence)
Of my desire for you.
When the current passes, also the threat................. menace should be used in place of threat
Of the time that flies, the time which separates us
And the current passes, I have in me the audacity
Of the magnetic field, and that is great! Here I'm tempted to use magnifique. I think most people would know the meaning of it.

what do you think about this one?

Our universe
Against the current
Return to Earth
And for good
When you long for me
Keep me informed
So I envision...
A rebellion
We remain static
When I say no to him
No more than six...
Speeches
He makes me panic
Of electrocution
My insulator
It's passion

Scruffydog777 02-10-2020 11:46 AM

I wish others would chip in and add their opinions because I'm no expert on this subject.

In my opinion,
"Return to earth
and for good", in the words of Curly, you are moidering the king's English!

https://youtu.be/9SFQf_mc68M?t=42

That doesn't sound good in a sentence and it doesn't sound good in a song.

I think it should be,
"Return to Earth,
this time for good."

As far as the line,
"Mets-moi au courant",
this line was used in the first verse in the song.
I'm not sure how familiar you are with the English language,
but imo, you can not come up with a better translation of this
line than "Keep me current".

From a Google search;
English → English - keep current
remain updated, be aware of current events

From Google translate, the French courant, means the English current.

Current sounds very much like courant, which is perfect for what you want with a translation of a song.

"Keep me current" is what it should be.

As far as the line "Pas plus de six...Allocutions"
I think this is a line that maybe had a double entendre.
We have to figure out what MF was trying to say.
Maybe one of the interpretations out there might give us an idea of what is meant, but for now, I guess we can leave it as is.

In those last 4 lines, the interpretation I've seen before that seems to fit the song very well is,
In my panic
of electrocution
my insulation
is passion or is the passion probably sounds better.

insulator sounds terrible

The end of insulation rhymes with the end of passion which works well here.

I hope this was a help to you.

joebanana 03-01-2020 05:52 AM

Alizée en Concert- L'Alize with English subtitles


https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_My...ew?usp=sharing

joebanana 04-05-2020 03:16 AM

Alizee Moi Lolita official video with English subtitles

I made a Croatian version of this video and would like to put it on YouTube, but I think the English version would be better for Alizee's popularity.
So I made an English version that probably needs a little bit more refinement by a person who speaks more natural English.
The first major problem you'll notice is probably the part where the angry mom yells at Alizee.
"Did cat eat your tongue" It's a phrase in my language "why are you silent" or "say something" and is a great connecting detail for later text (When I throw my tongue at cats)
But I never heard that expression in English so maybe it should be replaced, I don't know ...
Another possible problem is with "It's Not My fault"

It's not my fault
And when i give up
I see others
All ready to jump on me
It's not fault of...Me--------(when you watch the video it goes well with "Me" in the end...)

Here is the video

https://drive.google.com/file/d/13Be...ew?usp=sharing

24Shepherd24 04-05-2020 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 269187)
Alizee Moi Lolita official video with English subtitles

I made a Croatian version of this video and would like to put it on YouTube, but I think the English version would be better for Alizee's popularity.
So I made an English version that probably needs a little bit more refinement by a person who speaks more natural English.
The first major problem you'll notice is probably the part where the angry mom yells at Alizee.
"Did cat eat your tongue" It's a phrase in my language "why are you silent" or "say something" and is a great connecting detail for later text (When I throw my tongue at cats)
But I never heard that expression in English so maybe it should be replaced, I don't know ...
Another possible problem is with "It's Not My fault"

It's not my fault
And when i give up
I see others
All ready to jump on me
It's not fault of...Me--------(when you watch the video it goes well with "Me" in the end...)

Here is the video

https://drive.google.com/file/d/13Be...ew?usp=sharing



I've seen this video a million times, but this is the first with an English translation. Now, I think I'll watch it for another million. Thanks Joebanana.

joebanana 04-06-2020 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 24Shepherd24 (Post 269200)
I've seen this video a million times, but this is the first with an English translation. Now, I think I'll watch it for another million. Thanks Joebanana.

Without some constructive help, this is the best I can do.

Scruffydog777 04-06-2020 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 269206)
Without some constructive help, this is the best I can do.

I think there is room for a lot of improvement and I and I'm sure others would gladly help you.

Mr Coucou 04-07-2020 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 269187)
Alizee Moi Lolita official video with English subtitles

I made a Croatian version of this video and would like to put it on YouTube, but I think the English version would be better for Alizee's popularity.
So I made an English version that probably needs a little bit more refinement by a person who speaks more natural English.
The first major problem you'll notice is probably the part where the angry mom yells at Alizee.
"Did cat eat your tongue" It's a phrase in my language "why are you silent" or "say something" and is a great connecting detail for later text (When I throw my tongue at cats)

Yes--- "cat got your tongue" has a similar meaning in English.

For the captions, the mother could say to Alizee:
"Has the cat got your tongue?"


I've often wondered about that lyric:
Et quand je donne ma langue aux chats

If there was a song with an English lyric "When I give my tongue to the cat", then I might interpret that to mean "When I choose to be silent."

?

Edit:

Forget what I said about choosing to be silent...

This explains it:

"On the other hand, to give your tongue to the cat symbolizes failure. If you give your tongue to the cat you give the animal a lot of power, increasing the notion that the cat has more knowledge and wisdom than you."

To Give One’s Tongue to the Cat or a Month of French Idioms from A to Z

https://evelyneholingue.com/2015/04/...s-from-a-to-z/

joebanana 04-07-2020 01:35 PM

These are the subtitles I used and this makes it easier to fix


They call me Lo-lita
Lo or just Lola
That's the same

They call me Lo-lita
When I dream of wolves
It's Lola who bleeds
When I make a slip of the tongue
So much for laughing like crazy
I almost look like a phenomenon

They call me Lo-lita
Lo of life, Lo of Abundant love-----------(this part can always be made better)

It's not my fault
And when i give up
I see others
All ready to jump on me
It's not fault of...Me----------------( what is better, this way or "It's not my fault")
If I hear all around me
LOLITA
Me...Lolita!

They call me Lo-lita
Hot tempered and not
I'm half-cotton, half-wool
Quiet and with a mouth that doesn't speak
Mum that I'm a phenomenon------------------------(maybe "to mum")

They call me Lo-lita
Lo of life, Lo of Abundant love
--------------------------------------------------------
Yellow subtitles

(I hope because of the ugly words that you all realize that this is just acting)

Wait!
Wait... Wait!
Wait!
Wait!
I'd like to know...
I'd like to know...Do...
Do you love me?
I love you...And...
Do you have 200 francs?-----------------(That sounds too formal to me, maybe the same question in another more relaxed way)
Yes!
Thanks!
I'll give it back to you.
No, it's okay...Keep it...

Ah...I got tired a lot --------------(Ah...I'm tired a little.)

Scruffydog777 04-09-2020 09:00 AM

Maybe now that we have some more people posting, others will add their input because I've said before, my French is very, very limited.

Here is what I'd say for Alizee's lines in the song. As far as what the woman says who is yelling at her, I'm not even going to touch those lines.

Me I'm called Lolita
Lo or well Lola
It's all the same to me
Me I'm called Lolita
When I dream of wolves
It's Lola who bleeds
When I have a slip of the tongue, I have
a laugh that's crazy for one whose a phenom
I am called Lolita
Lo of life, Lo of a diluvial love
(As you mentioned, this part can be made better. Abundance isn't bad, but diluvial means a flood, in this case a flood of love, so I think it might be best to stick with diluvial, though it's a word I seldom hear)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It's not my fault
And when i give my tongue to the cats
(We've had a lot of discussion on this line before. I'm sure it has a double entendre that MF is noted for. I've heard there is a French saying that this line represents, but I also think it means something else which is pretty close to how I spelled it out and I can't say anything more in public. So maybe we're better off looking for the other meaning of it)
I see the others
All ready to jump on me
It's not my fault
If I hear all around me
L.O.L.I.T.A. (You had just put Lolita, but she does spell it out though the pronunciation of some of the letters might vary a little bit from the real thing)
My Lolita ( This I'm sure is the wolves talking to her)
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Me I'm called Lolita
Student below, stockings of methylene blue (I had always thought of it as jeans of methylene blue but maybe stockings of that color are something a lolita is more likely to wear)
Me I'm called Lolita
Hot tempered and not
Half-cotton, half-wool
Quiet and with a mouth that doesn't tell,
mum that I'm a phenomenon (Here the comma after tell and the small m at the start of mum are needed to show it's a continuation of the first line)
They call me Lolita
Lo of life, Lo of a diluvial love

joebanana 04-12-2020 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777 (Post 269254)
Maybe now that we have some more people posting, others will add their input because I've said before, my French is very, very limited.

Here is what I'd say for Alizee's lines in the song. As far as what the woman says who is yelling at her, I'm not even going to touch those lines.

Me I'm called Lolita
Lo or well Lola
It's all the same to me
Me I'm called Lolita
When I dream of wolves
It's Lola who bleeds
When I have a slip of the tongue, I have
a laugh that's crazy for one whose a phenom
I am called Lolita
Lo of life, Lo of a diluvial love
(As you mentioned, this part can be made better. Abundance isn't bad, but diluvial means a flood, in this case a flood of love, so I think it might be best to stick with diluvial, though it's a word I seldom hear)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It's not my fault
And when i give my tongue to the cats
(We've had a lot of discussion on this line before. I'm sure it has a double entendre that MF is noted for. I've heard there is a French saying that this line represents, but I also think it means something else which is pretty close to how I spelled it out and I can't say anything more in public. So maybe we're better off looking for the other meaning of it)
I see the others
All ready to jump on me
It's not my fault
If I hear all around me
L.O.L.I.T.A. (You had just put Lolita, but she does spell it out though the pronunciation of some of the letters might vary a little bit from the real thing)
My Lolita ( This I'm sure is the wolves talking to her)
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Me I'm called Lolita
Student below, stockings of methylene blue (I had always thought of it as jeans of methylene blue but maybe stockings of that color are something a lolita is more likely to wear)
Me I'm called Lolita
Hot tempered and not
Half-cotton, half-wool
Quiet and with a mouth that doesn't tell,
mum that I'm a phenomenon (Here the comma after tell and the small m at the start of mum are needed to show it's a continuation of the first line)
They call me Lolita
Lo of life, Lo of a diluvial love

I don't see any particular reason why we wouldn't translate angry Lolita's moms language.
It's Lolita, the character.It’s not real life Alizee,
otherwise I would be the first to defend her.

This is her most popular song and she is very proud of it, so we should pay a little more attention to translate it properly.
I will mark with numbers places where I see possible problems and explain below

Me I'm called Lolita
Lo or well Lola
It's all the same to me
Me I'm called Lolita
When I dream of wolves-----(1)
It's Lola who bleeds
When I have a slip of the tongue, I have
a laugh that's crazy for one whose a phenom
I am called Lolita
Lo of life, Lo of a diluvial love--------(2)

It's not my fault
And when i give my tongue to the cats-------(3)
I see the others
All ready to jump on me
It's not my fault
If I hear all around me
L.O.L.I.T.A--------------(4)
My Lolita---------------(5)

Me I'm called Lolita
Student below, stockings of methylene blue------(6)
Me I'm called Lolita
Hot tempered and not
Half-cotton, half-wool
Quiet and with a mouth that doesn't tell,
mum that I'm a phenomenon
They call me Lolita
Lo of life, Lo of a diluvial love
--------------------------------------------

-1
"When I dream of wolves"
(When I consider my mistakes)
like all of us, I did some research on the internet and found the possible true meaning of that line.
So if it fits, I would make a double line and add that explanation with a different subtitle color.

-2
"diluvial"
I don't know that word, but if it means flood of love it fits perfectly.

-3
"And when i give my tongue to the cats"
(And when i give up)
Similar to No. 1 We all know roughly what that line means, but if we go with a direct translation, someone who watching it for the first time won't find much sense in it.
so I would also do a double line there and add "(And when i give up)" with a different color, or some similar expression.

-4
L.O.L.I.T.A.
I didn't understand best what you meant to do here. The same way I did, but with a dot at the end of letters or something completely different?

-5
"My Lolita"
"My Lolita" or "Me Lolita"?
I like this, but I'm not really sure that it's the right way.
The name of the song is "Moi Lolita" and Lolita talks about herself in it, so it is "me Lolita" or "Me I'm Lolita"
I don't see why that change here, unless i miss something depending on the context in french that "moi" can be interpreted as "my".

-6
"Student below, stockings of methylene blue"
Because of that line I have brain damage.
What is right, a student below stockings of methylene blue or a student below tight blue jeans?
I searched the internet to find the answer to that question and found arguments for both ways of translating.
These are some of the answers to that:

"bleus de méthylène: literally “methylene blue.” This is a bit confusing; usually the term “bleu de méthylène” is used only to describe the chemical compound (thank you Wikipedia), but in this song the lyric is “bleus de méthylène” in the plural. “Bleus” is a slang term for blue jeans, and “les bleus méthylène” are a type of very tight blue jeans. I’ve even seen them being described as more like leggings. So Alizée is talking about her tight blue jeans, not her love of chemistry"

Of course there are different solutions:

"I think you are wrong about the jeans in the translation.
She says ” collegienne aux bas bleus de methylene”, which means literally “college girl with blue stockings” – see, college is different in France and you could translate it as schoolgirl too, but the word “bleus” was related directly to the stockings of the school uniform – les bas – which is naturally a plural."

After that, I thought about what to do next and decided to look at what school uniforms in France actually looked like when Moi Lolita was written, which would probably be late 90's.
Wikipedia says this:

France
Since 1968, uniforms have not been enforced in French schools, a few exceptions (such as Maison d'éducation de la Légion d'honneur, les Écoles TUNON, and Vatel). Xavier Darcos, a former teacher and Minister of Education from 2007 to 2009, is an advocate of the reintroduction of uniforms: "This is not outrageous. This removes the visible differences in social status or wealth. This is an additional factor of integration".[13]
Since March 2012, the students of the Boarding School of Excellence Sourdun wear a uniform with the insignia of their establishment.
Les lycées de la défense, formerly known as military schools, require their students to wear uniforms. At some universities, the academic dress is becoming popular.[citation needed]
In the French Antilles (Martinique and Guadeloupe), as well as French Guiana, a uniform has been required since September 2008.


So, there are no school uniforms in France in the late 90's, another dead end.
After that i tried to solve this problem with logic (live long and prosper :) ) and ask myself some questions.

Alizee almost always performed in costumes when collaborating with MF, have you ever seen her in blue stockings?
-No!
Did you see her perform Moi Lolita in tight blue jeans?
-Actually yes!
Coincidence???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ix7SRQDXPjM

Scruffydog777 04-12-2020 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777 (Post 269254)
................Here is what I'd say for Alizee's lines in the song. As far as what the woman says who is yelling at her, I'm not even going to touch those lines.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joebanana (Post 269270)
I don't see any particular reason why we wouldn't translate angry Lolita's moms language.
It's Lolita, the character.It’s not real life Alizee,
otherwise I would be the first to defend her.....................]

Well I made a very important distinction in my post by saying "I'm".

Even though I'm rather low on the hierarchy here, I have a lot to say about what goes on here and talk to the higher ups on many occasions. With what was said in the ML video, even though it was just a role for her, it bothered me to see that language directed at her.

If I thought it was wrong for the forum, I would've said either "We" need to remove it or discussed it with the mods about whether we should remove it, in fact, I did bring it up with the mods, but because it looked to be what she actually said, I told them, we should "let it ride", but that doesn't mean I have to participate in something that bothers me.

Feel free to discuss it with others in here, but as far as me participating in that discussion, you can count me out..........K.O.!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGpl8Y_kiCE

joebanana 04-12-2020 04:35 PM

My intention was just to make decent subtitles for the video, but it looks like it's all going in the wrong direction, and I feel a bad vibe, so my will to continue working on that translation goes down. As far as I'm concerned, I'm done with that.


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