[Split] Alizée on star story - career discussion

[User22]

Originally Posted by severianb

Yeah, she always says wonderful things about them, thanks them (she even thanked them in the liner notes on Psych).... but from comments like that, and the one about them "probably making a ton of money" licensing Moi...Lolita for others to sing... I have a feeling Mylene cut her off completely, and has never spoken to Alizee again. But that's nothing new for Mylene. I find it funny that people moan and whine about not getting enough updates or fan interaction from Alizee, when her main tutor, Mylene, gives absolutely nothing of herself except what you see in her performances.

I hate seeing people say we don't get enough from Alizee too, especially since we actually do. I could go on and on about things she has done for her fans that some people just don't even realize she has done or things we take for granted...

[Deepwaters]

Originally Posted by severianb

I find it funny that people moan and whine about not getting enough updates or fan interaction from Alizee, when her main tutor, Mylene, gives absolutely nothing of herself except what you see in her performances.

That's a lesson Alizée needed NOT to take away from her mentor. Alizée is not Mylène. Part of Mylène's success is her mystery and mystique. She can get away with that sort of thing. Alizée, whose success comes in large part from being more accessible, more herself, more the kind of person one can like and love, cannot.

[Corsaire]

Originally Posted by severianb

You are actually stating fact, not speculating. (You didn't know you were so smart, did you?) Here is a direct quote from her sweet lips to our unworthy ears:


From this interview: http://alizeeamerica.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5291

Mylene and friends wanted to keep racheting up the sexy... although how you get anymore sexy than what they had already done is beyond me, and apparently, was beyond Alizée also!!!

Ohhh... I do know that I am smart. It’s the people around me who don’t seem to notice

Merci beaucoup for this quote!
It’s from an interesting interview as well.
I was aware of a few comments that Alizée made about the breakup, but I didn’t know about this specific quote.

To follow up on this and what some other posters have said:

I am still convinced that Alizée/MF/LB could have continued to milk this operation for years and years if they all agreed to go in the same direction. But after MCE, I think MF/LB not only wanted to infuse more graphic sex in Alizée’s act, but also some of the MF/LB imagery. Evidently, MF/LB knew from the start that the Lolita image would be just a phase. I’ll even venture to say that MF/LB created MCE so to smooth out the transition between the Lolita image and a more typical MF libertine image that was to be introduced in the third album. If Alizée would have continued to collaborate with MF/LB, I think that by the fourth album she basically would have been a clone of MF, not so much in looks, but in the fundamental nature of the act.

Now, I think I can safely say this is all speculation on my part

[User22]

Originally Posted by Corsaire

I am still convinced that Alizée/MF/LB could have continued to milk this operation for years and years if they all agreed to go in the same direction. But after MCE, I think MF/LB not only wanted to infuse more graphic sex in Alizée’s act, but also some of the MF/LB imagery. Evidently, MF/LB knew from the start that the Lolita image would be just a phase. I’ll even venture to say that MF/LB created MCE so to smooth out the transition between the Lolita image and a more typical MF libertine image that was to be introduced in the third album. If Alizée would have continued to collaborate with MF/LB, I think that by the fourth album she basically would have been a clone of MF, not so much in looks, but in the fundamental nature of the act.)

I have never seen it said/viewed this way before...thanks for opening my eyes

[Corsaire]

Originally Posted by Aaronius31

I have never seen it said/viewed this way before...thanks for opening my eyes

Sure... as long as you keep in mind that I could be completely wrong about this.

Edit:
But I'm not!

[Scruffydog777]

Originally Posted by Corsaire

There are exceptions, but I think that, in general, what makes a music album (a movie, a TV show....) appealing to the masses is about 75% marketing and hype and 25% artistic/entertainment value. You could convince the masses to buy UEDS tomorrow if you wanted to. You could convince the masses Alizée’s has reinvented herself into a really relevant artist and that UEDS is a great achievement. You can sell Celine Dion and Madonna all you want or you can make them disappear in the background. You can make Lady Gaga one day and break her the next day. The entertainment industry can create any hype it wants to. The entertainment industry decides what it wants to sell to the people and not the other way around.

....

I think an important factor you left out is reputation. Surprisingly, the French people didn't seem to give Alizée any credit for the success of her first two albums. They seemed to think it was mainly if not all due to MF.

So with Psych, Lily was more or less starting off with no reputation, like a new singer that comes along and some good marketing could have led to much better results for this album, but with UEDS, she now had a reputation, one apparently the French people were not impressed with and I think no amount of marketing would have made much of an impact on the sales of this album.

Originally Posted by Corsaire

I beg to differ. I think that Alizée/MF/LB could have run this operation for at least 10 more years if they had wanted to. They could have kept the sexual titillation going and all that was really needed was an adjustment to the lyrics (less juvenile) and some other minor details to be worked out. Apparently, Alizée wanted to explore other avenues, but I wouldn’t reject the possibility that MF/LB could have offered Alizée some other type of image that she didn’t want to be a part of.

....

I don't think the music MF/LB wrote had to be titillating in order to sell. Look at the song Tempete. I think it's one of Alizée's most beautiful songs and there's nothing of a really sexual nature in there. It's a song about Napoleon and there are several other songs that aren't of a sexual manner, at least not on the surface. Lou ou Toi, A qoui reve une jeune fille and Amelie m'a dit are all beautiful songs, proving at least to me, that they didn't need sex to sell.

But maybe this was a direction MF didn't want to go in, didn't want to do damage to the reputation she had created for herself.

[severianb]

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777

But maybe this was a direction MF didn't want to go in, didn't want to do damage to the reputation she had created for herself.

Uh, Scruffy. Did you read the quote I just posted? There is no MAYBE about it. Mylene wanted to keep getting sexier (probably nude-colored outfits and simulated sex a la Britney, I mean, what else was there?) and Lilly didn't want to go there.

And those songs you listed are absolutely beautiful. Our angel's voice is at its best when singing soft, beautiful songs like that. When I listen to her sing those songs live (such as En Concert) it's sometimes impossible to distinguish them from the album version. I also think that's the way she should go with her next album. However, if you think those songs had much to do with her earlier success..... I'd say you're wrong. They sold the sexy/forbidden image.

[Deepwaters]

Originally Posted by Corsaire

I beg to differ. I think that Alizée/MF/LB could have run this operation for at least 10 more years if they had wanted to.

Part of what I'm basing my opinion on is the much lower level of success of MCE compared to Gourmandises. Alizée was on the threshold of adulthood, but the music written for her and the choreography of her performances kept the sexy ingenue image in place. I'm thinking especially of the dances and outfits for JEAM and JPVA, but also of the lyrics, all of which were suggestive of a young girl appealing to an older man.

My feeling is that Mylène was looking for something specific when she went talent-hunting. We know that she wanted someone to perform some songs that she felt she was too old to do herself. Mylène in her late 30s would have seemed preposterous in the role of Lolita, to be sure. So she found Alizée, who was perfect for the part, and crafted that image. The image was animated by Alizée's own personality which came through it to be perceived by her fans, but it was a bit more of a mismatch in the MCE era than in the beginning. Yet it still worked to a degree. But age 18 was really the last time it could. It could never work today. Alizée herself is too old to pull it off.

I would concur that Mylène and Laurent had the talent and skill to do something completely different under Alizée's direction, but the question is, why would they? They have their own partnership producing music and videos for Mylène and it is very successful. Mylène had accomplished what she set out to do with Alizée, and Alizèe had benefited from it with a career start like most performers can only fantasize about. From there, it was necessary for her to find out her own performing niche and her own style, and I don't think that M&L would ever have seen her as anything but a sideline. So it really was necessary that they split.

[RobandSandy]

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777

I think she's too strong a person to cry, but she has to be terribly disappointed, and depressed to an extent. I wonder if there's something we could do as a forum to show our support for her, cheer her up, let her know we will still be there for her.

I dont believe she is crying over the lack of album sales for UEDS either. I believe it is a true attempt by a true artist to reinvent herself. Which was absolutely necessary for her career to continue. Alizée is a stronger person than all that. And I for one and Sandy for two hope she NEVER gives in and becomes another slutty pop star prancing around "showing her panties" even though that seems to be what the majority of the world seems to want. Alizée is way too talented to lower herself to that level. All the Katy Perrys and Brittany Spears and Lady Gagas the mass media can keep as far as we are concerned. If it was just another pop slut I wanted to see I would have been following the afforementioned. The world of mass media has plenty of them, and I cant stand any of them, lots of "panties" and shallow of any true artistic talent. And, as I have stated in the past, What will Alizée do next??? As true of any true artist, Alizée is going to follow her heart and not give in to THE MAN!!! And when she does I will definately be getting her new work. Personally I cant wait for her next release!

[User22]

Originally Posted by RobandSandy

I dont believe she is crying over the lack of album sales for UEDS either. I believe it is a true attempt by a true artist to reinvent herself. Which was absolutely necessary for her career to continue. Alizée is a stronger person than all that. And I for one and Sandy for two hope she NEVER gives in and becomes another slutty pop star prancing around "showing her panties" even though that seems to be what the majority of the world seems to want. Alizée is way too talented to lower herself to that level. All the Katy Perrys and Brittany Spears and Lady Gagas the mass media can keep as far as we are concerned. If it was just another pop slut I wanted to see I would have been following the afforementioned. The world of mass media has plenty of them, and I cant stand any of them, lots of "panties" and shallow of any true artistic talent. And, as I have stated in the past, What will Alizée do next??? As true of any true artist, Alizée is going to follow her heart and not give in to THE MAN!!! And when she does I will definately be getting her new work. Personally I cant wait for her next release!

Amen Rob...

Edit:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777

severianb posted part of an interview where Alizee said she and MF parted on good terms, but I believe she said in another interview, when she released Psych, she sent the first cd to MF and LB and she never heard back from them.

One thing MF and LB didn't teach Alizee is how to mail things, thats for sure...