The blue and white dress of En Concert

[DrSmith]

[Roman]

Originally Posted by Corsaire

This was about the dress at some point, right? So...

Roman has provided an example of a “baby doll” dress and people often say that this style is (or was, at the time) popular or point out that Alizée wore more of these dresses later on in her career. Sure, but one also has to look at the dress itself, not just the style. I think there is the “baby doll” style and then there is that particular dress Alizée was wearing. Just like many clothes styles, you can have many different versions of the “baby doll” dress; for children, for adult, sober or flashy colors, see-through... That particular dress Alizée was wearing in the En concert is a children (pre-teen) dress and I don’t really see any possible debate there.

I would say that one reason to have chosen that particular dress was, as pepelepew pointed out, to make Alizée look, well, like a “baby” (or pre-teen)... and I would also add, like a “doll”. There is also, evidently, the titillating possibility that her panties could be partially revealed at some point. That certainly was something attractive for a good portion of Alizée’s fans at the time.

The dress was mainly very well suited for what I believe it was intended for; it fits perfectly some elements from the Gourmandises concept. It brings back the picnic theme of the video; summertime, checker patterns... you can also see what the En concert dancers wear during Gourmandises. It is most effective during for the “loup y es-tu?” part because Alizée does look like the little girl expecting the “wolf” to come out of anywhere and catch her, but she does not seem too eager to run away from it. For those who do not know, “loup y es-tu?” is a children’s game where a hidden “wolf” suddenly comes out of his hiding place to chase and catch the other children.

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loup_y_es-tu_%3F (French)

Little Alizée not too scared to be attacked by a “wolf” (also reminiscent of ML)? If you are an adult male, I suppose you know which part you are supposed to be playing while you watch this...

At 3:30, here:
...

Well, I'm sorry if I implied (or stated ) that there was no chance of symbolism or any other reasons for the dress. At least, what I mean is that I think you are probably right. It goes with the Gourmandises theme and like other dresses in the concert, there is the distinct possibility of getting a little look up her dress which is of course appealing to the young males (or not so young) in the audience. Indeed, this is a concert playing to all of her career up to that point which includes Gourmandises which she started working on at age 15 and when she had largely young girls as fans and goes through MCE which she worked on when she was 18 (19 in this concert) and nearing the end of adolescence and arguably her most sexually appealing (certainly as per historical norms). I think that all played into it, but that it's a pretty simple concept. Talking about it and trying to explain it makes it seem more complex than it probably was. I doubt that Mylène and Alizée gave as much thought to all of this than the continued discussions over the past 7 years might suggest.

Finally, I think we should go with Corsaire's explanation and thanks for the link. I didn't know or forgot that it was a children's game. You see, there are so many things that are simple to comprehend and obvious for the French that we might not get because we aren't from that country (not that that really makes much difference to the appreciation of a spunky, sexy, adorable, young woman).

Ok, here's a video just because it made me laugh.
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uo2Hb6h4qe4?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[User22]

Originally Posted by DrSmith

I totally agree my friend...

But anyway, HelixSix, I don't think Scruff was saying that people responded immaturely because they questioned him, but simply because some said he was wrong or that he "needs to stop saying crazy things" like Euphoria said. And Scruff is neither wrong nor right and should be able to express his ideas without people telling him he can't...

[lefty12357]

Originally Posted by Roman

Well, I'm sorry if I implied (or stated ) that there was no chance of symbolism or any other reasons for the dress. At least, what I mean is that I think you are probably right. It goes with the Gourmandises theme and like other dresses in the concert, there is the distinct possibility of getting a little look up her dress which is of course appealing to the young males (or not so young) in the audience. Indeed, this is a concert playing to all of her career up to that point which includes Gourmandises which she started working on at age 15 and when she had largely young girls as fans and goes through MCE which she worked on when she was 18 (19 in this concert) and nearing the end of adolescence and arguably her most sexually appealing (certainly as per historical norms). I think that all played into it, but that it's a pretty simple concept. Talking about it and trying to explain it makes it seem more complex than it probably was. I doubt that Mylène and Alizée gave as much thought to all of this than the continued discussions over the past 7 years might suggest.

Finally, I think we should go with Corsaire's explanation and thanks for the link. I didn't know or forgot that it was a children's game. You see, there are so many things that are simple to comprehend and obvious for the French that we might not get because we aren't from that country (not that that really makes much difference to the appreciation of a spunky, sexy, adorable, young woman).

Ok, here's a video just because it made me laugh.
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uo2Hb6h4qe4?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Thanks for the video, Roman. I found it quite enjoyable.

[Corsaire]

Originally Posted by Roman

Ok, here's a video just because it made me laugh.
<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uo2Hb6h4qe4?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Alizée is so adorable in that pink "baby doll" dress!

[Scruffydog777]

Originally Posted by HelixSix

So what is the mature way for people to say you might be stretching things? You can suggest things that might be questionable but nobody can question you?

Lets say I make a thread suggesting that MF knew about all the craze in Mexico but stayed away from that audience as much as possible because she hates Mexicans. I can imagine some people would shake their heads and face palm at that.

Actually there was only one post that I thought was of an immature nature and I think it's pretty obvious which one that is and I apologise to everyone else for implying there might be more by the use of the word some.

As far as your hypothetical post, the only thing wrong with it is the use of the word Mexicans. I don't know why but though the word Americans would be perfectly fine, the use of the word Mexicans sounds some what derogitory and I think that's because I've heard it used so many times in a derogitory way so in this case I would have written it....................because she hates the people of Mexico, but as far as if you had proposed that she stayed away from the audience because she hated the people of Mexico, that I think would be a perfectly fine idea to propose to the forum. Are we supposed to think Mylene is perfect?

[pepelepew]

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777

As I said before, I had always thought of that dress from the first day I saw it as being a maternity dress and I oftened wondered why MF would have her wear such a dress so I presented a thread where I thought Mylene may have meant it as a warning to Alizee which I dont think is that outlandish an idea.

Now some people responded in an immature fashion to this post and some people responded in a mature fashion such as the post by Corsaire, who said that it was chosen for it's connection with Gourmandises which I think is now the most plausible explanation for this type of dress to be chosen and the added benefit that it would be an easy change during the concert.

A firemans pole and different colored firemans garb would have been even more convenient in the green room. Alizee would have been really cute dressed as a fireman, but it wouldn't have fit with the theme. I agree with Corsaire. Preteen was the message in my opinion. Although a little red riding hood costume would have been appropriate to the game of big bad wolf that Corsaire disclosed. Great stuff Corsaire!

[Euphoria]

Originally Posted by JoeNY

Mylene hates Mexicans??!!! That woman is evil. I thought she was just jealous of Alizee's international success, which is probably why she kept Alizee out of the U.S. too. That Mylene is getting on my nerves.

Oh please. She wasn't keeping her from anything. Mylene is way more successful than Alizee will probably ever be and thats because she listened to the people around her for a while. She also has fantastic marketing skills.

It really annoys me that so many people here act like Mylene is some sort of sadist or Stalin like dictator. I'm sure at the time, Alizee probably enjoyed being sexy. She was at an age where girls are just starting to explore their sexuality and become young women. They enjoy wearing provocative clothes and being flirty and teasing. As she got older, its obvious she started being influenced by her friends and boyfriend, and started doing the more adult rocker thing instead of the cute, sexy tease. People change, just because they were a certain way for a while doesn't mean that anyone was forcing them. She was a young girl trying to figure out who she was.

[Roman]

Originally Posted by Euphoria

Oh please. She wasn't keeping her from anything. Mylene is way more successful than Alizee will probably ever be and thats because she listened to the people around her for a while. She also has fantastic marketing skills.

It really annoys me that so many people here act like Mylene is some sort of sadist or Stalin like dictator. I'm sure at the time, Alizee probably enjoyed being sexy. She was at an age where girls are just starting to explore their sexuality and become young women. They enjoy wearing provocative clothes and being flirty and teasing. As she got older, its obvious she started being influenced by her friends and boyfriend, and started doing the more adult rocker thing instead of the cute, sexy tease. People change, just because they were a certain way for a while doesn't mean that anyone was forcing them. She was a young girl trying to figure out who she was.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you really, but Alizée did say that Mylène wanting to play her too sexy was where the wedge between them started. She was under contract as well and has said that M&L demanded perfection. And for other reasons there is some basis for saying that she was forced by them to do certain things. But I think force is kind of a wrong term. Alizée wanted to be a big star and that what they gave her. Also, regardless of the disagreements that they eventually had which she eventually admitted to and what Alizée actually felt about various things (which I really can't figure out anymore as I no longer trust words uttered in an interview aimed at promoting an album), Alizée has only really ever expressed gratitude toward them for what they did for her. And she did send them her new album after they broke up, which certainly suggests that she wanted to continue an amicable relationship with them. I'm sorry that didn't work out. Maybe they didn't care about her anymore or maybe they were the ones hurt by the breakup. I don't know and can't jump to any conclusions and that's a private matter between them.

Nevertheless, Alizée has certainly given the impression of not being a person who is particularly inclined to do doing things that she does not want to do because someone told her to. She might actually be a bit too stubborn for her own good in fact. Again, I don't really know. There's so much in the way this industry works that prevents things from being clear. Humans in social situations tell big and small lies all the time, sometimes for personal gain, sometimes to avoid hurting someone else's feelings, sometimes to seem more consistent just because we all waiver more or less in our feelings at different times of the day/month/year.

If you are a fan of pre-2004 Alizée, I don't see how you can dislike Mylène Farmer (and Laurent?) in general. If you are just disappointed about how things turned out after that and are lashing out, well, how about we just let it go then?

By the way, I think JoeNY was being sarcastic, just joking anyway considering what he was responding to.

[HelixSix]

Originally Posted by Roman

By the way, I think JoeNY was being sarcastic, just joking anyway considering what he was responding to.

Yeah I'm pretty sure he was. I really hope other people don't think we were being serious about that Mexico thing.......I was just making up a conspiracy theory since this topic was compared to one.

Anyway I think the dress was for variety.