Women and Alizée

Bamagirl · #1 08-08-2019, 10:42 AM

I very much appreciate Alizée — for her music, her dancing, her ability as a performer in general, and everything I have learned about her personality and character. I also think she is lovely, and I admire her beauty and charm.

I feel fortunate that, as a woman, I can appreciate another woman’s attractiveness and appeal without feeling threatened.

I know that most members of this forum are men, and I am interested to know what the women in your lives think of Alizée. Do you share your admiration of her with your wives, girlfriends, mothers, sisters, daughters and/or other female relatives & friends? What are their thoughts about her?

CleverCowboy · #2 08-08-2019, 11:20 AM

I was married for 23 years, 2 kids (both boys). It ended in 2012, and I first saw Alizee in 2006. I would have loved to share Alizee with her, but she would have thought the worst. The ex was very attractive yet extremely insecure and jealous. I never gave her a reason to be jealous, but apparently even me talking to the checkout girl at the grocery store was flirting and I would pay for it later. So no, never shared Alizee with her. I would never hear the end of it.

I've been seeing somebody exclusively for a number of years. She would often say "he's handsome" or "she's beautiful" about somebody on TV or in real life. She has a thing for Cary Grant and Jimmy Stewart in old movies. Doesn't bother me in the least. I make no effort to hide Alizee from her, but I don't offer it up either. If she stumbles across a Alizee CD or sees my watch history on YouTube and asks who she is, then I'll tell her. I expect the whole thing would be a non-event.

One thing decided though is that if anybody makes me choose between her and Alizee, it would be Alizee every time. I don't need that level of insecurity in my life anymore. Been there, done that.

Edit:

One final thought I will add. Bamagirl, you have been on this forum for a while. You understand how most of us long time male fans view Alizee. We admire her early years as well as who she is right now, and give her due respect. If I had to introduce somebody to Alizee, they better have the time to hear the whole story. Us men, especially those of us of the older variety, simply cannot tell a woman (or a man for that matter) that we are big fans of a French singer and show them JEAM as the introductory video. There is a significant risk of being labeled something we are not. This is probably why I think most men just don't bring up Alizee to their significant others.

Aragorn97 · #3 08-08-2019, 04:45 PM

To talk about Alizée with other people is very delicate for us men.
I have never talked about her with anyone, except one person, who is probably my closest friend. But he is a man and I only told him that she is my favorite singer and let him listening to some of her songs while I was driving in my car. I don't know if he has searched something about her on YouTube, but the few times he asks me something about her (for example if i bought another of her albums) I get chills, because as CleverCowboy said they have to hear the whole story. So personally I find almost impossible to talk about her with a girl/woman.

The problem is that you can be misunderstood and "labeled something you are not". For example, I would feel uncomfortable if I went to my mother, a girlfriend (now I'm single) or a female friend of mine and let her watch Alizée's live performances like JPVA or one with the fur dress, where the camera isn't exactly discreet with her backside. And I'm 22... I've seen that there are members that are 30 years older than me.
The fact is that Alizée is much more than just a singer/performer to me. And that's probably true for many people here.

Moreover in my country, the French are not considered very pleasant, so you look a bit weird if you listen to their music. Lol

I'm sorry I can't answer your question precisely, but I tried to make you understand why. Sometimes I think about how I would talk about Alizée with a girlfriend, but I really don't know where to begin. As I said it is something very difficult, but in my opinion, it shouldn't be a secret with your partner. My hope is to find a girl who likes Alizée (or at least knows her), but I think that's more improbable than winning the lottery

CleverCowboy · #4 08-08-2019, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aragorn97

I get chills, because as CleverCowboy said they have to hear the whole story. So personally I find almost impossible to talk about her with a girl/woman.

What girl/woman would give you that time to tell the whole story? Let me answer that question for you.

Not many. If you say too little, then you could be misunderstood and mislabeled. If you say too much, then you are at risk of being thought of having an obsession and Alizee becomes competition to your girlfriend. So it's a lose-lose right there. Best just to be somewhere in the middle - you are a fan and that is not going to change and here's why.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aragorn97

And I'm 22... I've seen that there are members that are 30 years older than me.

MINIMUM. Let's put it this way. Both my sons are now older than you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aragorn97

The fact is that Alizée is much more than just a singer/performer to me. And that's probably true for many people here.

That is exactly true for most members here. That is what is so difficult to explain to others. We have had discussions here that try to figure out what it is about Alizee that draws us the way she does. Making sense of it is difficult enough. Trying to put it into words to tell somebody else almost is an impossible task.

Aragorn97 · #5 08-08-2019, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleverCowboy

What girl/woman would give you that time to tell the whole story? Let me answer that question for you.

Not many. If you say too little, then you could be misunderstood and mislabeled. If you say too much, then you are at risk of being thought of having an obsession and Alizee becomes competition to your girlfriend. So it's a lose-lose right there. Best just to be somewhere in the middle - you are a fan and that is not going to change and here's why.

Well, I think you're right. How did that guy say a few years ago? In medio stat virtus... I think his name was Aristotle eh eh.
Now all we have to do is to find the right middle of the thing. But I think it depends on what type of person we're talking to and what type of relationship we have with her.
Anyway, good and wise advice. When the time comes, I'll tell you what happens

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleverCowboy

MINIMUM. Let's put it this way. Both my sons are now older than you.

...
I knew I was a young member, but I didn't think that much. Wow O_O

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleverCowboy

That is exactly true for most members here. That is what is so difficult to explain to others. We have had discussions here that try to figure out what it is about Alizee that draws us the way she does. Making sense of it is difficult enough. Trying to put it into words to tell somebody else almost is an impossible task.

That's exactly what I wanted to do: I was already thinking about creating a thread about this, don't know when, maybe tomorrow or in a few days. I've seen that there are discussions about this, but I need a comparison.
Because, to use your words, I think I'm at risk of having an obsession.

CleverCowboy · #6 08-08-2019, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aragorn97

I knew I was a young member, but I didn't think that much. Wow O_O

Age has no bearing here. We have a member here that was very active last year and is a few years younger than you, Edsel Di Meo. He was from Venezuela and a great guy. Of course, Venezuela has major problems and he moved to Columbia to finish college. He still checks in from time to time when he can, but I think he is experiencing some hardship. We are very welcoming to younger fans.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aragorn97

That's exactly what I wanted to do: I was already thinking about creating a thread about this, don't know when, maybe tomorrow or in a few days. I've seen that there are discussions about this, but I need a comparison.
Because, to use your words, I think I'm at risk of having an obsession.

Feel free to create a thread to discuss whatever is on your mind. If you feel you are risking being obsessed about Alizee, I can think of a million things worse to be obsessed about than this decent human being.

Two comments on Alizee's M6 Awards 2000 video shows that she has admirers that lurk in the background.

Usa France
There are no words to describe the love I have for this woman.

osiris
I love her so much. I teared on this video. It's hard to breath when someone feels very happy. It makes you cry.. I love Alizée since i was 15 yo. When I saw her first music video of Moi Lolita. Time passes and all her song i have loved. I love her purely And i promised my self to give my first daughter her name Alizée. It's 2018 and I'm still watching this video because I love Alizée until today.

Scruffydog777 · #7 08-09-2019, 04:50 AM

Well I think I've learned a lot on how to present Alizee to people who don't know her and I wish I had done things differently years ago. I would show anyone and everyone her videos, even ones when she was at her youngest and ones when she was at her sexiest, thinking people would see beyond that to what the specialness of this woman there was at least in my eyes.

I would show them ML in Amsterdam and JEAM pour Laurette and Gourmandises. The problem with that is many people have different tastes in music and in beauty. For those who Alizee's music and beauty didn't interest them, they automatically thought well the attraction for me, must be her sexiness and though she was unbelievably sexy at times, that was only a small part of the Alizée phenomenon. I think women were quicker to jump to that conclusion, maybe because they saw Alizée as a threat or the competition and in that regard, a competitor who had an arsenal of weapons.

So I'm very careful of what I show people nowadays. I'll show them J'en ai marre and Moi Lolita from her Spain performance and the ACC video. Then if they truly show an interest in her, I'll break out her sexier performances.

Here's a picture from her Amelie performance ala En Concert. I might be wrong about this but the guy on the left looks like a man who is in tremendous awe of her beauty, her person, her singing, her dancing and her sexiness and I think that represents most if not all of us in here. The guy on the right looks to be a wolf. He sees one thing in Alizee and I think that is what most people we try to introduce her to, see in us and the older you are, the more they are inclined to think that. They can't understand how we can worship a beautiful young woman like this without turning it into something sexual.

My own sister who lives less than 2 blocks away had no idea what Alizee really meant to me. Though we've done many things together over the years and she's never seen me treat women in other than a gentlemanly way, she didn't have a clue, I'm sure thinking the attraction was a sexual one. She even said to me last year "Maybe she has an older sister?". I guess she was under the assumption that I wanted to be in a relation with Alizee and if Alizee wasn't available, maybe an older sister was. I would swim across the Atlantic if I heard Alizee was going to have a 'real' concert and I only went to the studio because there are no concerts, there are no more Les Enfoires shows. What I really want is to see her perform, but my sister does not get it. I finally had to write her a long letter, telling her I was disappointed in her for thinking that of me and telling her why Alizée meant so much to me but I feel it was a waste of time.

Attachment 2762

CleverCowboy · #8 08-09-2019, 08:20 AM

Our culture has fashioned what is considered appropriate or not. A guy under the age of 25 watching videos of an 18 year old Alizee would not raise any eyebrows. If you are older than that doing the same, all of a sudden you risk being suspected of being some kind of predator.

Age differences become less of a factor as both age... sometimes. A middle aged man being attracted to women much younger than himself is "creepy" and he is a "dirty old man". Unless of course he is filthy rich, then it is almost expected that he have a young trophy wife on his arm.

A middle aged woman with a thing for young guys is not a "dirty old woman", but a "cougar". It's a sign of empowerment and is celebrated.

Very confusing and guys get the short end of that stick.

Not every attraction has to have a sexual reason behind it. My first instinct towards Alizee was to be protective, not romantic. This is hard for most people to understand. My first choice is to have any significant other know about how much of a fan of Alizee I am, but it's a flip of a coin whether they would understand my view of her.

Aragorn97 · #9 08-09-2019, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleverCowboy

A We are very welcoming to younger fans.

That's for sure

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleverCowboy

Feel free to create a thread to discuss whatever is on your mind. If you feel you are risking being obsessed about Alizee, I can think of a million things worse to be obsessed about than this decent human being.

I will create it as soon as I have time. These days there are guests in my house, so I'm busy all day.

Bamagirl · #10 08-10-2019, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CleverCowboy

I Bamagirl, you have been on this forum for a while. You understand how most of us long time male fans view Alizee. We admire her early years as well as who she is right now, and give her due respect.

CleverCowboy, I have always noticed and been deeply impressed by the high level of respect for Alizée shown by the men in this forum. It is a major reason I feel very comfortable being a member and posting here, not to mention in my role as a moderator.

I, personally, see no reason why a women should feel threatened by men noticing and appreciating attractive qualities--of any type--in another woman. But, unfortunately, that does seem to often be the case. For me, admiring another woman--be it her beauty, her fashion sense, her intelligence, her character, her talent, or any other quality about her--is not materially different from admiring anything that is worthy--art, music, beauty in nature, etc. I admire certain people (both men and women) for a wide variety of reasons. And I also admire works of art, literature, engineering, etc.

Edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scruffydog777

Well I think I've learned a lot on how to present Alizee to people who don't know her and I wish I had done things differently years ago... What I really want is to see her perform, but my sister does not get it. I finally had to write her a long letter, telling her I was disappointed in her for thinking that of me and telling her why Alizée meant so much to me but I feel it was a waste of time.

Attachment 2762

Scruffydog, it is a shame you have had to deal with that reaction. But, unfortunately, many people see things based on their own experiences (or, often, lack of experience.) Often this can mean they evaluate things in black and white, without going any deeper. I hope that you sister will have thought over what you told her, and maybe come to understand the more complex feelings you have about Alizée. It can be very hard to explain to people feelings and deep emotions that they themselves have no personal knowledge of or familiarity with. For what it's worth, though, I think there are a lot of people (like the members of this forum!) who do truly get what you are saying. Thanks for your very thoughtful and personal response.