Mlle Julliete Discussion Thread

[Cooney]

I've duplicated this post on its own thread in the translation section, to keep better track of it.

Ok all - I did my best to transcribe it by ear, and translate the result. Here's the French and the English, as best as I can figure it. Obviously, there may be errors, but hopefully not too many. I put footnotes on things I'm particularly not sure of, or which may seem wierd.

Note: Updated a couple times to include feedback from later discussion.

French
Mademoiselle Juliette a
Son Romeo dans l'alpha
De Verona hommes elle court
Jolie syndrome de l'amour
Shakespeare s'amuse de sa muse
L'heroine tough qu'il abuse
Elle monte vite dans les tours
Le vent ecrive va aimer jouer des tours (1)

Mademoiselle Juliette a
Pas vraiment la tête
Choisir entre Montague et Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliette
Meurt en fait de la tension (2)
Bagnole, s'abri coca décapsulé (3)

Mademoiselle, prend des ailes
Le face se faire mettre en pièces
Dans son rôle et niveau, qu'elle
Pas de repli de tout pièces
Cette commedia dell'arte (4)
N'est pas assez déjanté
Quand fin William rendre l'aime
Il n'y a plus que ca pour éviter le drame.

Mademoiselle Juliette a
Pas vraiment la tête
Choisir entre Montague et Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliette
Meurt en fait de la tension
Bagnole, s'abri coca décapsulé

Mademoiselle Juliette a
Pas vraiment la tête
Pleurer sur Montague et Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliette
Meurt en fait de la tension
Bagnole, s'abri coca décapsulé

Aahhhh
Aahhhh
Aahhhh
Aahhhh

Mademoiselle Juliette a
Pas vraiment la tête
Choisir entre Montague et Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliette
Meurt en fait de la tension
Bagnole, s'abri coca décapsulé

Mademoiselle Juliette a
Plus vraiment la tête
Pleurer sur Montague et Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliette
Meurt en fait de la tension
Bagnole, s'abri coca décapsulé


English
Mademoiselle Juliet has
Her Romeo in the Alpha,
From Verona men she runs
The beautiful syndrome called love.
Shakespeare, entertaining himself with his muse,
The tough heroine whom he abuses
She climbs quickly to the towers
The written rumors will like playing tricks (1)

Mademoiselle Juliet
Really doesn't have the head
To choose between Montague and Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliet
Is dying from the tension(2)
A prison, her shelter is an open bottle of coca (3)

Mademoiselle takes wings
What faces her makes her smash things apart
In her role and level, where she
Has no fall back point for all those pieces
This commedia dell'arte (4)
Is not insane enough
When finally William gives her love
There is nothing that can be done to avoid tragedy

Mademoiselle Juliet
Really doesn't have the head
To choose between Montague and Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliet
Is dying from the tension
A prison, her shelter is an open bottle of coca

Mademoiselle Juliet
Really doesn't have the head
She cries about Montague and Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliet
Is dying from the tension
A prison, her shelter is an open bottle of coca

Aahhhh
Aahhhh
Aahhhh
Aahhhh

Mademoiselle Juliet
Really doesn't have the head
To choose between Montague and Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliet
Is dying from the tension
A prison, her shelter is an open bottle of coca

Mademoiselle Juliet
More than anything has the head
To cry about Montague and Capulet
Mademoiselle Juliet
Is dying from the tension
A prison, her shelter is an open bottle of coca



Notes

1: The use of "Le Vent" while literally meaning "the wind," is used in the sense of hearing a rumor - to get wind of something. A reference to the letters in the play that didn't make it to her lover. Also, "jouer des tours" means to "play tricks." Forgive me, francophones, if I didn't conjugate the verbs correctly. That many in a row messes with me (even though they are pronounced the same).

2: Still under review. Previously I'd had something here that didn't really work with the rest of the song. Feedback?

3: The word "abri" (shelter) is a masculine word, and it would normally be "son abri" instead of "s'abri," but I believe that's just for lyric purposes.

4: "Commedia dell'arte" is an old Italian form of comedy, and is the proper name of it in any language. Calling R&J commedia dell'arte is a very bitter and harsh thing - it's a bitingly sarcastic use of that terminology, almost painfully so. The usage refers to what must have been Romeo and Juliet's feeling that they were trapped in some horrible deific joke. The playthings of much greater powers who didn't give a damn about the emotions of their pawns.

As always, I welcome comments, criticisms, and feedback.

[Deepwaters]

One correction on the transcription above. Note the difference in pronunciation on what appears to be (but isn't) the last syllable of Juliet's name between the first and third lines of each stanza and in the chorus. What you're spelling as "Jullietta" I believe is actually "Julliette a," i.e. Julliette has. In the third stanza, Alizée pronounces it "Julliett-eh" (rather than "-ah") which is the name as a stand alone.

So the chorus would actually read:

Mademoiselle Julliette a
Pas vraimant la tête
Choisir entre Montague et Capulet

And you have it correctly translated. However, along the same lines I believe the first two lines should be translated as "Miss Juliet has her Romeo in the alpha," although I'm still not clear what "in the alpha" refers to.

Edit: Yes, I realize "a pas vraimant la tête" is incorrect grammar, and technically it should be "n'a pas" but it's a song lyric.

I think I would suggest, as an alternate translation of the first few lines:

Mademoiselle Juliet has
Her Romeo in the aristocracy
Of Verona, to the bad heart
A pretty symptom of love.

[classicgalx]

Originally Posted by Cooney

4: "Commedia dell'arte" is an old Italian form of comedy, and is the proper name of it in any language. Calling R&J commedia dell'arte is a very bitter and harsh thing - it's a bitingly sarcastic use of that terminology, almost painfully so. The usage refers to what must have been Romeo and Juliet's feeling that they were trapped in some horrible deific joke. The playthings of much greater powers who didn't give a damn about the emotions of their pawns.

Could this also be a reference to 'Comedy of Errors,' also by Shakespeare? In a bitter sense R&J is much like Comedy of Errors, if you see it as a comedy all of the errors of the nurse, Friar lawrence and the messengers pretty much cause the deaths of Romeo and then Juliet.

Also I think that it is impossible to place the drug used in R&J. It was probably some mythical drug, just made up to suit the story. Also Shakespeare wrote R&J probably in 1594. 1595, or 1596 But the story had been around since the 1400's in Italy. So it is impossible to say what drug was used if it was indeed a drug that existed.

Just a Thought

[Cooney]

Ah ha! I think I may have it!

Instead of "me refaire l'intention" meaning "Again gives me the intention"

How about:

"Meurt en fait de la tension" meaning "Dying from the tension"

That makes more sense, and allows the conversion of the wierd Baigner to RMJ's more fitting Bagnole.

This is why I love having people ask questions and point out things that don't work. It's just like a game, trying to figure out exactly what I'm hearing, and if people didn't keep asking about stuff, we wouldn't get half as far as we do.

Originally Posted by classicgalx

Could this also be a reference to 'Comedy of Errors,' also by Shakespeare? In a bitter sense R&J is much like Comedy of Errors, if you see it as a comedy all of the errors of the nurse, Friar lawrence and the messengers pretty much cause the deaths of Juliet and then Romeo.

Just a Thought

I think it's unlikely to be a direct reference. Commedia dell'arte is something very specific, which Alizée would be familiar with having attended a performance school. A veiled allusion, including both meanings, might be possible, but I wouldn't bet on it. Personally, I don't grant Comedy of Errors and Romeo and Juliet many similarities. One is a true comedy fueled by mistaken identity and a dose of deus ex machina, and the other is a true tragedy fueled by hatred and misfortune. Really, I don't think anybody in Romeo and Juliet makes a mistake, in the dramatic sense, until Romeo mistakes Juliet for dead. Everything prior was either misfortune or intentional deception.

[CFHollister]

Originally Posted by Cooney

Personally, I don't grant Comedy of Errors and Romeo and Juliet many similarities. One is a true comedy fueled by mistaken identity and a dose of deus ex machina, and the other is a true tragedy fueled by hatred and misfortune. Really, I don't think anybody in Romeo and Juliet makes a mistake, in the dramatic sense, until Romeo mistakes Juliet for dead. Everything prior was either misfortune or intentional deception.

And then Cooney brings the Theatre Training Hammer.

[Cooney]

Originally Posted by CFHollister

And then Cooney brings the Theatre Training Hammer.

I'm not trying to "bring down the hammer" really - there are thousands of people who could kick my butt in all knowledge theatrical, and I'm sure it wouldn't be hard for somebody to do a bit of research and disprove me on some point or another. I'm just trying to do my best to contribute to the discussion, as Shakespeare was the topic of my undergrad thesis and many other essays, and I very much enjoy his works. :-)


So tell me Mod, would it be the pinnacle of arrogance and/or pointlessness if I made a new thread over on the Translations forum to keep this thing updated with changes from feedback and new ideas? It's a pain digging back to previous pages to find it in the middle of stuff.

[CFHollister]

Originally Posted by Cooney

So tell me Mod, would it be the pinnacle of arrogance and/or pointlessness if I made a new thread over on the Translations forum to keep this thing updated with changes from feedback and new ideas? It's a pain digging back to previous pages to find it in the middle of stuff.

Of course not. Go for it. Allez!

[brad]

Originally Posted by Cooney

So tell me Mod, would it be the pinnacle of arrogance and/or pointlessness if I made a new thread over on the Translations forum to keep this thing updated with changes from feedback and new ideas? It's a pain digging back to previous pages to find it in the middle of stuff.

hey if you want to take the time to do things like this, don't let anyone stop you

i know everyone really appreciates it. feel free to do whatever, we are going to have a lot of stuff like this to do in the near future